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ZSKB
Ballenjongen

Uit: Ukraine
Posts: 1
Reg.: 10 augustus 2006

Hi everybody!
Thanks god I've found English forum Ajax fans page! :P

Im writing to you asking for help! Hope youll help foreign Ajax fans who love Ajax as well as you people do!

Not long ago our site team have wrote to official Ajax site asking to help but them first ignored us long and then refused. As we've got from their letter to us, we foreign fans do not need them at all! Now observing such attitude there is no chances to ask again
Thats why we turn to you hoping you wont do the same!!!

So We, Ajax Russian speaking fan site, Superajax.com, want at our site to make a section which will be dedicated to "Ajax ultras fans".
In that section we are planing to show Ajax ultras history facts, point to their special attitude towards Ajax, also put in some photos, tell some interesting facts and may be smth. else.

Ive seen facts here --------- >http://vak410.nl/tifosi
And also have smth. at my computer about f-side and sup. home

but caz of language cant get anything. :\( :\(

(In general I have some info about "vak410 gate" in English but its too weak to be presented)

So my request and question can you, PLEASE, translate it in English, for me to translate it in Russian and then put it at our site??
If yes - I will put the rest out soon!

Thank you very much for understanding and co-operation! :denk

Also you are welcome to visit us http://www.superajax.com/
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Joeri
Basisspeler

Vak: 415
Posts: 977
Reg.: 7 augustus 2003

I got nothing better to do at my work since it is "Komkommertijd" :) , so I would be glad to help you if you give me some text you want me to translate!

[Dit bericht is veranderd door Joeri (op 22 augustus 2006 11:47:20).]
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EenAjacied
Basisspeler

Vak: -
Posts: 800
Reg.: 8 april 2002

I think he wants the text written on this page -> http://vak410.nl/tifosi to be translated.

Have fun Joeri ;B
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Joeri
Basisspeler

Vak: 415
Posts: 977
Reg.: 7 augustus 2003

jezus christ!

i thought he was talking about a couple of sentences! :D
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Woot
Idool

Vak: 107
Posts: 3274
Reg.: 26 februari 2003

I know someone who find it very fun to translate dutch into english. I will ask him.
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Revo
Legende

Uit: Overslag/Tilburg
Vak: 413
Posts: 9461
Reg.: 20 augustus 2002


quote:HR
ZSKB schreef:

Hi everybody!
Thanks god I've found English forum Ajax fans page! :P

Im writing to you asking for help! Hope youll help foreign Ajax fans who love Ajax as well as you people do!

Not long ago our site team have wrote to official Ajax site asking to help but them first ignored us long and then refused. As we've got from their letter to us, we foreign fans do not need them at all! Now observing such attitude there is no chances to ask again
Thats why we turn to you hoping you wont do the same!!!

So We, Ajax Russian speaking fan site, Superajax.com, want at our site to make a section which will be dedicated to "Ajax ultras fans".
In that section we are planing to show Ajax ultras history facts, point to their special attitude towards Ajax, also put in some photos, tell some interesting facts and may be smth. else.

Ive seen facts here --------- >http://vak410.nl/tifosi
And also have smth. at my computer about f-side and sup. home

but caz of language cant get anything. :\( :\(

(In general I have some info about "vak410 gate" in English but its too weak to be presented)

So my request and question can you, PLEASE, translate it in English, for me to translate it in Russian and then put it at our site??
If yes - I will put the rest out soon!

Thank you very much for understanding and co-operation! :denk

Also you are welcome to visit us http://www.superajax.com/
HR
Must say: great site!
How did you become Ajaxsupporter:)?
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AFCA CBS
Lid 2de elftal

Uit: Zoetermeer
Vak: 126
Posts: 386
Reg.: 22 maart 2004


quote:HR
Revo schreef:

(...)

Must say: great site!
How did you become Ajaxsupporter:)?
HR
You don't become an ajax supporter, you are born as an ajax supporter
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ajaxwintcl
Vedette

Uit: Amsterdam
Vak: -
Posts: 2048
Reg.: 30 augustus 2003


quote:HR
AFCA CBS schreef:

(...)

You don't become an ajax supporter, you are born as an ajax supporter
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Hehehehehehe :D
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ZSKB
Ballenjongen

Uit: Ukraine
Posts: 1
Reg.: 10 augustus 2006

First about pages and translation! :denk
Yeah, I've meant all that info at http://vak410.nl/tifosi + some information at my comp... B)
First part of that info (TIFOSI VAK410 )I have but it's not somehow fresh as it is at the site now! I have an old version of it in English...

You know, to tell honestly I want to make just bomb article about ultras! Truly and bright!
I mean I want to write interesting facts which will leave a trace at reader's brain!
In general its very hard to conduct the site which is not native (you see the point?)! Unfortunately we - AJAX, are not too popular as some Mutd, barsa, milan etc. in comparison with others teams. That's why the same situation is with Russian speaking fan sites!
We haven't hundreds of users!
But we all don't give up caz Ajax was born 4 us and we were born 4 Ajax!
Thats why we are trying to hold on together and to attract new users with some special efforts and actions like this!
B)
I can give you 2 more Ajax Russian speaking sites just to compare and you'll see that not everything is simple!
Once I (myself) asked for help one forum but don't get it! Thats why as a last hope I turn to you...

Revo,
I have been fanning Ajax since that incredible final in 95! It was my 1st football match in general which I had been seeing in my life!
I was 12 child and I didn't know anything about Ajax as well as Milan but by chance have chosen Ajax! From that very moment my heart is scared with Ajax emblem as well as body with Ajax tattoo...
;);B
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Joeri
Basisspeler

Vak: 415
Posts: 977
Reg.: 7 augustus 2003

Well, I've helped some other guy translating an Ajax-text (about Ajax' history), but that wasn't specifically about Vak 410.

and this text is just a little too big..
If I were you, I would send Woot a private message, about that friend of his :)
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JL20
Vedette

Uit: 0172
Vak: 413
Posts: 2436
Reg.: 19 maart 2004

Maybe we can all do it together in a few parts, so nobody have to do the big whole story.
I won't be all perfect, but I will try to do it my best.

The first action.

Amsterdam, November 25th 2001, 13.01. Game; AFC Ajax - Psv.
The first real action of Tifo is become reality.
Before the game Ajax-Psv, a group 410people came together at the entrance of the Amsterdam ArenA, to work on the first bandieri's for Vak410.
A few people from 410 did know that this was very populair in Italy, and they used it very often there.
That's why Vak410 has produced the first bandieri's ever in Holland.
Now these days a lot of clubs has followed Vak410, and they have also bandieri's.
The people from Vak410 has chosen to made 7 bandieri's, with the initials AFC AJAX, and also one with the old (original) logo of AFC Ajax, and the flag of Amsterdam.
All this leads in combination with 2 torches in a beautiful sight, and it would be bigger and bigger later.

Because the succes from the first tifo-action from 410, they continued with it.
They set up 'Tifo410' this group with 4 people has to making care about the Tifo on 410.
Also they had to find a way to get money, to pay the stuff for the Tif0 in the stadium.
That went good, and that's the reason why there are now plenty of merchandising from Vak410.
410 sweaters, t-shirts, caps, badges, postcards, stickers, and a lot more merchandising is sold to Ajax supporters in and around the Amsterdam Arena.
The collection is still growing bigger and bigger, and the supporters also can put money in the account from 410 on the bank.

Because the money, Vak410 could make the second Tifo-action in the Amsterdam ArenA, in the game against the big enemy; feyenoord rotterdam.
They have ordered 750 red and white paperrols to throw, from Italy, and they were delivered just right on time.
So even the second Tifo action in the history of 410 was a big succes.
And on this way, our 'friends' from rotterdam meets Vak410 for the first time, but sure not for the last..



Who continue's with the season 2002-2003?
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NFD410
Legende

Vak: -
Posts: 17595
Reg.: 26 juni 2000

If i'm not mistaken, ZSKB has got the first part, but a slightly different in English. I gave him a translation I once (about 1 year ago) made about 410 through the VAK 410 forum.

We're still busy updating that particular part of our website, so please be patient!

By the way: When i was in Lithuania this summer, i spoke to a guy from Ukraine, who was wearing a Ajax sweater, but didn't know shit about Ajax... :)

[Dit bericht is veranderd door NFD410 (op 23 augustus 2006 12:54:53).]
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Joeri
Basisspeler

Vak: 415
Posts: 977
Reg.: 7 augustus 2003


quote:HR
By the way: When i was in Lithuania this summer, i spoke to a guy from Ukraine, who was wearing a Ajax sweater, but didn't know shit about Ajax... HR
OIG-bak? ;)

[Dit bericht is veranderd door Joeri (op 23 augustus 2006 13:13:28).]
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Patrickc1982
Regelmatige invaller

Uit: Almere
Vak: 423
Posts: 691
Reg.: 11 maart 2002

maybe this translater will help you

http://www.worldlingo.com/nl/products_services/computer_translation.html

TIFOSI VAK410

The first action

Amsterdam 25 November 2001 13.01 hours, Ajax- psv. The first real Tifo-actie of profession 410 are a fact. In avance a group 410 ers had come work at the head entrance of sand to for what the first bandieri's on profession 410 would be. A number of 410 ers knew that this was in Italy of the most attentive forms of Tifo and thereby the bandieri as a first in the Netherlands profession 410 was introduced (meanwhile its some other clubs followed). There to make A X 7 bandieri's with then the characters A F was chosen C A J, moreover there was made 1 with the old logo and was 1 with from Amsterdam flag. All this led in combination with 2 torches to a beautiful whole, already this later still several times were exceeded.

As a result of the success of the first action and in the spell of Tifo some 410 ers went further. Thereby Tifo410 was set up, this group existing from 4 man had ensure coordination on the Tifo to happen on the profession. Also she had will hang out the flag in search to income this way, bandieri's, spandoeken and Tifo pay for action to be able. This went and meanwhile Cd's with Ajax numbers, beautiful Ajax pullovers, Ajax T-shirt, original cards, profession 410 stickers and profession 410 badges to medesupporters is well sold there. This collectie is regularly extended. Also there regularly a collecte takes place and is there the possibility money of paying.

By income 2e the Tifo action on profession 410 could be carried out on 3 March 2002. 750 white and red werprollen had been ordered in Italy and on time were provided exactly. Thus also 2e the action could be called a success. And this way friends also our did not determine Rotterdam for the first time, but certainly for last, knowledge with us.

Season 2002-2003

In the season 2002-2003 the Tifo come on profession 410 just real well loose. It were in the beginning a couple small hang out the flag and spandoekjes, this season there several large hang out the flag from Italy were ordered and a number of himself were tevens made there of which 1 of but-kindest 5 at 5.5 meters. Also Tifo410 became what recovered more professionally and there new people.
Also there more and more bandieri's came on the profession, also 410 ers became enthusiastically and got to work themselves with making bandieri or spandoek. By the successes in the Champions League it was a busy season for the Tifosi. There were much important games in which wanted show themselves them of their best side. Thus a number of mega-bandieri's was made with then images of Litmanen, winter, Witschge, the old logo and a Buldog. Also there were a number of playful doeken and bandieri's like against psv it consider doek Groeten from the Champions League and against *********es a doek with Ajax real football (as an answer on their choreography: the tank real grass, what was a lot retrieved then already) also against *********es it earlier-mentioned doek with hooghoudende Witschge was shown, this to frustrations of the supporters from Rotterdam. During Ajax- reporting office Milan reminded we the Milanese Tifosi to a memorable day in Vienna on 24 May 1995. And from that time descending cried: WHO The Fuck is Milan?! on doek it was also manufactured. Also this season a time a operation with werprollen was carried out and was, an unfortunately partly failed, action with sterretjes. As a slap on the fire arrow there was the last thuiswedstrijd against lord peat. Beside the farewell of winter and Witschge that using 2 life sizes images on doek and 40 meters long bedankspandoek (Ries & Arie Patat thank special generation!) strength became was added there also the first Bandieri Battle. Aim of these Battle was 410 exhort ers themselves bandieri to make. On our site a guide to making Bandieri appears and many used these to make there themselves. The recall worked and some dozens 410 ers made their own bandieri, of which was rewarded most beautiful with a beautiful t-shirt. This sea of bandieri's, in combination with the size hangs out the flag and the doeken for led the farewell of winter and Witschge to a splendid blade which lost in particular clear that the Tifosi van Vak 410 correct in is geslagen. Meanwhile the TIFO on VAK410 are think no longer. With rule half-measure the most huge megadoeken and choreographies are considered and are made on the North side of the stadion. In the photograph album on this site nearly all action, which represented with the arrival of 410, stands.

5 years 410!

The game Ajax FC Utrecht stood dominated by the 5-one year old existence VAK410. This was seized to carry out action a number of on the professions of 409 & 410. At rise of the players became a spandoek unfold on which stood surrounded large 5 by a laurel aureole. On the baludoek the years 2001 and 2006 shone. Beside the spandoek 150 bandieri were omhoog loved s with then the colours Ajax and Amsterdam. For commencement of second half a second action was carried out. Concerning the first 8 became range a spandoek unfold on which several Ultra stood s represented with certain characteristics of this culture. On the baludoek the text appeared: ULTRA MENTALITY. On standing part of 410 and 409 radiated which hangs out the flag from what stood on doeken , a mass of werplinten, bandieri s and were see there.

Vocal

Beside the TIFO there the also vocal part becomes always more important and improves. Since the season 05-06 the drums have been introduced, which support the songs rythmically and ensure that the songs continues longer. The songs by several capo s. is also used. Capo are a type of song LEADER, on its to indicate a certain song is sung yes or no accompanied with arm movements. This can be done using a loud-hailer or a sound installation. Because of this it is occurred that several songs is sung by each other.

Spandoeken

No supportersgroep without spandoek. Also on 410 the large spandoek is not think. After for 5 years faithful service is the SAVES & WHITE FIGHTERS AMSTERDAM replace ANNO by PROFESSION 410 2001 . This spandoek hangs nearly all games under VAK410 and only in special cases will replace to become other spandoeken. Also the red spandoek with then the white characters VAK410 already some years exist. This spandoek hangs also nearly all thuiswedstrijden, but also at many away matches. Doek has also already hung in several countries such as Italy, France, Denmark and Israel.

environment team

Except the Tifosi of 410 also the environment team with rule half-measure Tifo-acties organises. In the environment team several supporters from the complete stadion sit, also a number of boys from 410 sits. The environment team looks after flags the, however, well-known at each europcup game. Recently the environment team has organised in association with VAK410 largest choreography. During the game Ajax PSV kept 35.000 supporters red and white cut down omhoog. On the North side onstond: ANNO 1900 , long side East: AJAX AMSTERDAM and on the south platform 1976 F-SIDE . On the Internet site http://www.ajax.Netherlands club environment team is further information on the environment team, also stand mostly photograph s of the organised action.



The history of the ultra culture

The first groups ultras appeared in Italy in the end zestiger years. It were mostly supporters between 15 and the 25 years which deviated clearly of the trusted picture of the adult football supporter. Collected in the cheap professions of our, showed them directly a number of unique properties which was totally new in Italian football. This development expressed himself in marking its own territory, its own tribunedeel, by means of large spandoeken with then the group name and carrying the paramilitary look where one used of extremist kledingstukken as a parka s, Dr.Martin s boots and camouflagejassen. Also carrying a scarf in the club colours became a fixed component of new culture. From the beginning the Ultras distinguished themselves by their new manner of supporten. Of the Braziliaanse torcidas the use of hoorngeschal and drums was taken over. The use of club scarfs to these vervolgens above the head to sway under gezang to encourage, honour the players its own club and the antagonist to intimidate, it was taken over of the English supporters. The Ultras became by these uses the 12th paragraph of the elftal; the 12th man therefore.

Typically also the use of fire work was. Bengaalse torches, rookbommen and lichtkogels brought an extra piece perception on the platforms and added their own dimension. Also first choreographies were carried out as the groups organised themselves more better and. Putting on enormous multicoloured shows which were regularly intensified at the start of the game in the coming decades the trade mark of the Italian Ultras will become.

Of the oldest and most known Ultragroepen the Fossa dei Leonie van AC Milan are. The group has been established in the year 1968 and had itself established on the south platform of the San Siro. In November 2005 an end has come to this fraaie group, after mutual brawls between the LEADERs and threats, from the Vikings of Juventus, to private lives of the Ultras, has been decided keep the group on at heven and this way the honour to itself. Meanwhile there is a new group born on the Curva Sud: Guerrieri Ultras. Another old group is the Fedelissimi Granata van Torino. The group established in 1951, stands still on the Curva Maratona but is no leading group more in Italy.
The first group which uses effectively made Ultras of the term was the Ultras Tito Cucchiaroni (1969) of Sampdoria, named after to the then top player of the club from Genoa.

In fast tempo, beginning years 70, hundreds small groups started unite itself to large groups of thousands of Ultras to whom gradually assume power in Italian our started. The groups formed themselves from several contexts, such as districts, cities, schools and the uitgaansleven. Many members belonged already to political groups and parties or movements within conservative Italy in the years 70.

It explains the large influence of political stromingen and the following expressions on the Italian platforms. Correctly the friendship and fanaticism which belonged to their political conviction gave feeding to the Ultragroeperingen. A another aspect that typified the Ultras the strong drang to its own territory was. Normal supporters were requested seat oneself in a pleasant but squat manner in other professions of the stadion. To the group name vervolgens more strongly to let happen images of wild animals, weapons were frequently chosen and other similar images as symbol. The groups financed their action with collectes on the platform and every group member was charged with a task, varying of buying material to organising bus travel. As from the year 1974 changed the attitude of the Ultras. Violent meetings between competing supportersgroepen occurred always more often. During the games Torino Sampdoria and ASH Roma Lazio Roma was thrown as from the kickoff of everything on the field and took place fightings on the platforms. The intervention of the police force with traangas had a wrong affect, one became more aggressively and the fightings continued outside the stadion. Not only the derbyrivaliteit but also the political convictions at the several groups wakkerden the hatred feelings to and duels between the left (Milan, Atalanta, Vicenza) and right (Lazio, Inter, Verona) groups. Increasing violence shocked the Italian society and led to questions at the press and political and the Italian football association came under very of the government end years 70 with drastic measures; vlaggenstokken, drums and aggressive spandoeken were prohibited for a number of months.

Years 80

In the years 80 lane the ledental of the different groupings to hundreds and in some cases even to thousands of members. There was absolutely no club in the serial A, B or C which could not count on the unconditional support of one or more supporter groupings. This development also led to a complicated network of alliances and rivalry where the Italian justice did not have or hardly grip on. The proportions in that time lie now very differently. Then friends the largest enemies have become. Where German and English clubs can put each other's rivalry aside at visiting games of the national elftal, the this Italian fans do not succeed. The reason of this is find in the many years' fight between the different cities and the political movements.

What also striking was to the years 80 is visiting away matches. This became with increasing violence always more dangerous. Only the most of fanatical fans had that absolutely no fear for the dangers which were run at the visit to another city went along. At the away matches the strength and geslotenheid of the group time on time were tested if one eye came stand in eye with the mostly much larger group of the thuispartij. At away matches present is without showing its own groepsspandoek it was seen as a large form of cowardice.

The action on the curva s names the massive forms, both in creativity and in scope. There bored itself a still lasting competition between the different groups. Who descended the most beautiful action and troefde this way the antagonist. Sampdoria with its flag of 90 at 32 meters, ASH Roma fans with a choreography of 10.000 cut down. Torino with counterfoils of substance and bowl oil with throwing thousands wc-rollen.

The drug use became in that time always populairder, especially smoking cannabis. Cosenza s Nuclei Sconvolti used as first the marihuana booklet as a symbol what a bump brought in conservative and leading catholic Italy.

Years 90

In the years 90 it was changed much. The Ultras of the first hour had now reached the age of 40 and were now house fathers. Much fundamental values of the Ultra-zijn were differently understood by the new generation or were simply ignored. It became a vogue express you as a Ultra but only a little be absorbedded firstly in culture.
Another side of the tale is that the Ultras no longer to think of being from our. Also the power of the groups reached far, this way far that the Executive Board took into account even the opinion of its supportersgroepen. Also the use of fire work was laid in many cities to links, this to large anger of the Ultras: the use of fire work is traditional bestandsdeel of our culture. Soon we can carry scarfs also no more

the best the translater can make it

[Dit bericht is veranderd door Patrickc1982 (op 23 augustus 2006 14:05:46).]
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ziskab
Ballenjongen

Uit: Ukraine
Vak: -
Posts: 10
Reg.: 24 augustus 2006

Deze posting is niet nieuw sinds je vorige bezoek Gepost op 24 augustus 2006 om 19:51:23.  Profiel  Stuur een email  Stuur een privébericht  Bezoek de homepage  ICQ 302411963  Wijzig deze posting  Quote deze posting in je reactie
HR
first I want to say sorry 4 my rude words which've given me red card and banned me.
That's why it's my new name... :denk

I WOULD BE GREATFULL TO SAY THANKs:

2 Patrickc1982!!!

you 've done unbeliveble job! Thank you very much! :B :B :B


2 JL20!!!
thank you very much as well!!! your wish to help me even in that way costs expensive! ;B ;B


2 NFD410!
Thank you 4 your 1st help and good memmory! ;)
About guy from Ukraine...
Its a pity that there wasn't me!
That guy is worthy to get a good thresh for those fact that he doesnt know what he is wearing! Ass-0
;)
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ziskab
Ballenjongen

Uit: Ukraine
Vak: -
Posts: 10
Reg.: 24 augustus 2006

Deze posting is niet nieuw sinds je vorige bezoek Gepost op 24 augustus 2006 om 20:06:28.  Profiel  Stuur een email  Stuur een privébericht  Bezoek de homepage  ICQ 302411963  Wijzig deze posting  Quote deze posting in je reactie
HR
2 NFD410!
as I got, you are a member of 410! yeah?
can you answer me this -

) in past when I was just looking your photos I thought that in 410 gate are seating only "ultras people" (those who sing all the time, make fireworks, make Spandoeken, show Bandieri and so on), now I see that it's some how wrong thought. Yeah?
in general everybody can buy season ticket in vak 410 gates than seats near you.
I'm I right to this last fact?

next,
as I got there are 3 types of fans inside your gate.

First - people who sing but not all the time, they sing when they want.
Second - people (ultras) who sing ALL THE TIME and do action as showing flags, scarfs, banderies!
third - (tifosi vak 410) is a group of people who like more to act inside and outside the gate, rather then to sing, but still sing with others as well!
Also you (ultras) trust them and they (tifosi) trust you!
In general there are about 50 guys inside of your stream and some leaders.

thank you!
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